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I burn myself out proving that I'm the only one that can do all the work. You can't do this. This is not working. Who do you think you are? I was in one of those places where I knew that I didn't have the answers to all the questions I was looking for. The issue is that we think our value is caught up in all that activity and all that adrenaline and all that work. You're valuable regardless of all of that. Anybody that's in business should be asking that question, what would I love? What would I love my life to look like? What would I love my business to look like? What would I love my relationships to look like? What would I love? Because when we get really familiar and comfortable with that question, our heart then actually communicates the very things that we would love. Welcome to The Business Game, the show that breaks business down into real levels from zero to over $50 billion, so founders can see exactly where they are and what comes next. Today's guest is playing at level one, which sits in the zero to $1 million bracket, the founder's startup and survival stage. At this level, you're proving the model works. You're validating demand, refining positioning, and fighting for consistent revenue. The challenges? Doing almost everything yourself, hiring your first team member, and stepping from practitioner into CEO. The goal? Turn expertise into traction and build momentum that's repeatable, not accidental Welcome to The Business Game. I'm Kalina Stenner. I'm Steve Plummer. Be sure to like and subscribe to the show wherever you're listening. Today, we're joined by Kerry-Ann Luketic, a life mastery consultant, international speaker, author, trainer, and founder of Kindere Life Coaching. Kerry-Ann works with high-achieving entrepreneurs and visionary business leaders who have built successful businesses in pursuit of greater time and financial freedom, only to discover that growth can bring its own pressures, overwhelm, and uncertainty. In this episode, we'll dive into how, through her work, she helps leaders navigate the mindset, identity, and internal shifts required to grow their business without sacrificing the life they originally set out to create. Let's dive in with Kerry-Ann Luketic. Welcome to the show, Kerry-Ann. Oh, thank you. It's a joy and a delight to be here. So excited. Yeah. Thanks. So Kerrianne, you're playing at level one, so can you tell us about Candera Life Coaching and how it began and how it works, for people who don't know? Yeah. Absolutely. So, um, I've been blessed to be in business since about 2019 professionally as a coach, and, um, explored different ways in which I wanted to show off. And it wasn't 'til just recently, in the last couple of years, that I really identified that one of my favorite things was helping people shine. Uh, so hence the birthing of, uh, and so I pronounce it as Candere Life Coaching, um, because candere is the Latin version of shine, to shine. And so I love to bring people into that place because, in all honesty, I believe each and every one of us, individual, unique, and beautiful as we are, have our own unique brilliance. And so when we really identify what that is and how we're meant to be here on the planet at this time, showing up in the world, and we shine, we come alive. And when we're fully alive, everybody's attracted to that kind of light, so that makes life so much more fun. That's beautiful. Yeah. Wow. Yeah. So, um, so how did it start though for you? Where did you... What... Was there a moment that sort of tripped over for you? What's your background? Yeah. Yeah. So I guess, uh, I love to say to people that I got to take the scenic route to where I am today. I'm not your traditional, "Have a c- one career and go and do that for the rest of your life." I certainly got to have varied experiences throughout my childhood and growing up. My amazing dad had many, many businesses when I was his little girl, and I would go with him. So I've been a Milko girl. Do you remember when we used to deliver milk to the door? I do, yes. In the bottles. I used to do that. Yeah. Yeah. And then Dad went on to have other businesses, like a cleaning business, and so I know how to clean houses and commercial properties. Then he went into office furniture, so I can, I can build a drawer box and put it into the, the desk and I can upholster a chair and I can do all the things to do with office furniture. And so that inspired me to be in business for myself. And so through a series of beautiful experiences from going to university to, uh, working as a liquor licensing consultant, then to starting my own Tupperware business. Yeah. Back in the day, Tupperware. Yeah. I was a Tupperware lady- Yeah. Wow Doing all those beautiful things, even owning a driving school for five years, teaching young people how to drive, uh, I found that my gifts and my talents were all being refined through all those beautiful processes, and it just made sense that at, in 2019, that I would step into being a coach and a trainer because I love to teach and I love to bring out the beauty of what a person has in their world that they may not see for themselves. And so that's kind of how I got to where I am today, and then I had this beautiful, beautiful experience of meeting my mentor, Mary. Um, she has the Brave Thinking Institute, where I'm now certified as a life mastery consultant. All her work that she'd been doing for 50 years kind of collided with all the work that I had done leading up until this point in time and was like, "This feels like a perfect match." And so I just had to say yes to being a part of what they do as an institute and, um, getting certified under their qualifications. Oh, wow, that's a beautiful story. What would you say is on the horizon for Candour8 Life Coaching, um, and where do you wanna take the work over the next few years? Oh, I have some beautiful big dreams. So one of the core programs that I do for my amazing clients is called Dream Builder. So we actually teach this, the proven reliable system of creating a life that you would love. So I do the work myself, and so I've dreamt up this beautiful dream for my business, and I do see that, um, I have a amazing company that has a beautiful name, which I won't reveal because I love it so much. It's not ready yet. Not ready yet. But I have offices here in Australia, in the US, and over in Europe, and a beautiful team of people working with me so that we can take this work into, uh, beauty m- beautiful multinational organizations, uh, to meet the leadership teams, the executives, and all their amazing staff, to create cultures where we actually support people living lives that cause them to come alive. So they, we're drawing out the beauty of who they are, and they're expressing that in their workplaces, in their own businesses, whatever that might look like, so that we have, across the world, all these organizations, all these beautiful people doing the work that they were actually put on the planet to do. And because that's so aligned with who they are, it just makes everything so much more beautiful, and we will see beautiful mysteries that have been hidden away, I believe, come to the surface because of the work that we do. Wow. Wow. That's amazing. Yeah. That's a great vision and- Yeah, we'll have to bring you back onto the show. Yeah, yeah, absolutely. Yeah. All right. Let's, uh, let's dive into the nuts and bolts a little bit then, Kerrianne. Um, so you work with high-achieving business leaders. You know, they've built a business chasing freedom. But quite often in that space, they end up buried under the weight of their own success, if we can put it that way. So can you walk us through what that pattern looks like for people you work with, for a client, when they first land in front of you? Absolutely. Um, I have a particular client who comes to mind at the moment, and, um, she's very, very successful in her career. Um, she's a clinical psychologist nurse, and, um, she's exceptional. She's got all, all the beautiful certificates, all the qualifications. She's done, done the work, and she took the big, bold step to have her own company form and create her own clinic. And so she'd been operating in that space for, for a little while, and when we met, um, some of the words that she used was, "I feel like I'm drowning in my business. Um, I have all this internal pressure. I feel like my head might explode. I'm not too sure what's going on. I did this because I wanted to create a different reality for myself. Uh, and so I, I feel stuck. I don't know what I'm doing." So quite often that's kind of the language, that they're stuck in their head because there's so much to think about, feeling internal pressure inside, so their chest is tight, or they're, they're stopping themselves from breathing throughout the day because they're so focused on trying to get all the work done. Or perhaps even it's 2:00 AM in the morning and they're waking up and going through all the conversations from the day before, preempting all the conversations for the day to come, and they're trying to solve all these problems while they're looking at the ceiling and feeling their body go, "Can we please just go back to sleep?" Um, it's all that- I'm sure no one listening is doing that, right? Like it's, yeah. Yeah. Oops. Yeah. All that. Yeah. Yeah. All that kind of pressure. Yeah. And so for the most part, a lot of my clients are... And that's, that's really a moment of expansion. That's how expansion shows up. Our body is trying to keep us safe. Our internal world is trying to figure out all the hows, and we get, getting that kind of internal rub, that resistance happening b- because we haven't been there before. We're trying to figure out how to get there, but at the same time we've got all these old stories that are coming along with us that no longer serve us anymore. So in amongst all of that is an opportunity to have beautiful growth and transformation. Mm. Mm. And, and so is there a certain type of person who shows up more for you- Mm than, I don't know, normal or... You know, you know what I mean? Like, the... Is there a... And I don't wanna, um, stigmatize it or, or anything like that, but do you see a certain personality type where someone could go, "Actually, that's me"? I, I guess to a certain extent, yes. Um, I definitely keep the doors open for those people who resonate most with the message. Yeah. And we get all different kinds of people come through the door. But there is definitely that type A personality. They're, they're very motivated. They've got things they wanna do, and they've got a long list of what that looks like, and so they're ready to go. Um, they've got very They're usually visionaries in some capacity, a very big, beautiful vision that usually is something that hasn't been seen before anywhere else. So it feels a little uncomfortable, a little bit uncertain, but it's this huge, big vision, and a deep, deep desire for something to be different in the world. So whether it be that, that what they bring to the world provides a solution that hasn't been fully expressed and experienced, or whether it be that they just know that there's so much more available to them, so much more available to all the people that they'll work with, but they haven't quite got the language for it yet, but there's, there's just this inner knowing. And so they're probably the three core things that I notice the most in the people that come into, into my room. Yeah. Right. That's interesting. Yeah. And I'm sure, like, uh, what, probably 90% of our listeners- Yeah can probably put themselves in. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Whoops, that's close to home kind of thing. Yeah. As you, as you're describing that person, I'm like, "It's me." Yeah. Yeah. Um, so you talk about inner coherence as the missing piece between having a big vision and actually living it. Um, so for business owners who have never heard that term before, how would you define it in practical everyday terms? Yeah. Good question. Um, for me, inner coherence, it, it simply means that the different parts of you, um, the different parts of you, and I'll explain what they are, are working together rather than pulling against each other. That's probably the easiest way to give a description of that. Mm-hmm. So, like, for example, you might have a vision in mind that says, "I wanna build a million-dollar business." But another part of you is saying, "Well, that feels unsafe." And then your identity might say, "Ah, I'm not sure I'm that person that can actually do that." And then your nervous system might respond to the visibility with stress and just get really stressed out, and then that behavior then reflects and, and changes the course of action that's taken. Mm-hmm. Yeah. So we have this beautiful space of making a conscious goal where your internal system all clicks together and everything is working toward the very big vision that you have. And so when we bring our vision, our beliefs, our identity, our nervous system, our energy, and our actions all together so that they're coherent, then you're all moving in the same direction. There's less resistance, there's less agitation, and there's more forward movement and beautiful flow, and that's what you really wanna be operating in, that gorgeous flow of life moving through you. Yeah, absolutely, 'cause that's, that resonates I know for me, and probably for you too, Steve- Mm just based on my conversations we've had, of you have, y- you've got... There's multiple... You're, you were multifaceted, and they're sometimes, like, going different ways, and if they're not coherent, it can make it really challenging to move forward or move anywhere. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, absolutely. Yeah. So can we dive into that a little bit, Kerri-Ann? So i- in the business world, in, in success even, and the success industry, there's a, there's a lot of talk around mindset. And how... I mean, you take it further than that and talk about nervous system and identity work, which you just mentioned. So can you explain the difference- Between those two things. 'Cause you know, you do hear a lot of, and it can be very surface level, just think positive, you know? And do a vision board and everything will be fine- Yeah kind of thing. So can you talk to, to those two problems? Yeah, absolutely. Vision boards are awesome. They very much are just a board with a vision on, and so, uh, and there's nothing wrong with that. It's how we engage with it, because we're the, the human being that is bringing that vision into being. Yeah. So mindset matters, right? But mindset is often where most people stop. They just like, yeah, like you say, just have a positive thought and everything will work out. Yeah. So you can think that I'm confident, I'm capable, I'm ready for this, and then you might get that sales call and your body tightens up and you trip over your tongue, or you procrastinate about sending an email, or a classic example, you avoid being visible. It's more exciting to go put the washing on the line than actually do the reel that you know that you're meant to do. Or you might talk yourself out of the price that you point, your price point air. I'm at five and a half thousand dollars. No, let me offer it for two and a half thousand dollars today, because that feels better. So- That, you know, you can have a vision board, and you can have affirmations, and you can have all the mindset work happening, but if your nervous system is really showing up in a way that doesn't feel safe, and your identity is telling you you're not that person, then you've got all this clash happening, like what we were just talking about. So for sustainable growth where you feel stable, and you feel strong, and you feel at ease in what you're doing, because to grow and build and create anything, it comes from a place of ease and flow. So we wanna create that sustainability within you. And to do that, we work with just more than the mindset. Mindset with nervous system, with inner coherence work, all of it comes together so that you become the person who is in your vision. Yeah. Yeah. Okay. So in practical terms then, what's one thing that a business owner can start doing today to create more space for growth, to cr- to be okay with the visibility, to, to start creating that life you want? Absolutely. One of the things that I love to do with my clients is to allow them to pause for a minute. Quite often, we run through our days 100 miles an hour, getting all the things done that are on the list that we feel like we need to be creating, doing, or otherwise, and we don't pause enough to actually bring in the vision. So we do a beautiful work with some breathwork, where we pause, we create space in our, in, in a moment, and we bring the vision to mind. Because most of us are being taught to keep the vision, the dream, the goal off in the far, distant future because that's where it is, 'cause it's not here yet, and we strive and we push to get to it. But what if we brought it into the present, into the now? We see it, what it looks like when it's all worked out. We feel it, what it feels like. Exhilarating, thrilling, oh my gosh, I did the thing. I feel so fulfilled. All the feelings that come with having actually achieved it and see that, that dream, that, that beautiful vision realized. And then from that place, we now take action steps. So what is my next most inspired step to take? Because your vision, your dream actually has a pathway integrated into it, and only you can access that pathway because you are the highest authority on your dream and your vision. So when we take a pause and we look at it from the what is my next most inspired step to take, then we can get a really aligned forward-moving step that will actually accelerate your growth, accelerate you into your dream, rather than you trying everybody else's strategy that actually isn't aligned with what you're doing and it not getting you anywh- getting you anywhere. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. So can I play devil's advocate here for a moment? Mm. 'Cause I can, um, you know, I'm, I'm, I'm really, I'm resonating with a lot with what you're saying, but I can also see business owners, you know, hardened business owners who are saying, "Look, I've got, you know, team to, to look after. I've got customers. I have systems," and, "No, I don't... This is just woo-woo stuff, whereas I'm in the practical real world." Like, what, what response have you got to that? It's almost a, we've talked about mindset, it's almost a closed mind, but- Yes a, a very pragmatic mind as well. So what response would you have to that? Oh, I love it. The practical is part of the spiritual, and the spiritual is part of the practical. You can't separate either or, or either from. And so for me, my response would be, "Well, then you need this more than all the other activity that you're doing. Like, this, this should be the first point of reference for you, if you are willing. And, and you don't have to be willing. If you're happy with how it's all working for you, and the, the pressure and, and all the things that are happening in your world, if that's working for you, I'm celebrating that, and I'm right there with you as your partner in believing. If it's not working though, and if it feels like it's too much, and your head's really noisy, you're not sleeping at night, all the other things, then what if we tried something different and I showed you an easier way to make all this work for you, and one where... that will get you your time back, have more money in the bank, make you feel really good about the work that you do, and get you living a life that you absolutely love?" Yeah. That's not a bad pushback, I guess. Yeah. That answered your question? Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Go on, Karen, over to you. And, and said with, and said with the greatest amount of respect and love. Yes. Yeah. And you could feel that. Yeah, yeah. I think that's why I... It wasn't a sales... Like, it- No just felt very genuine- Yeah which I think is... Yeah. All right, moving along. Yeah. Karen, over to you. So Karen, you've described your own biggest breakthrough as simply saying yes to yourself after watching a masterclass. So what was actually happening internally in that moment, and what shifted the, what shifted that, um- Mm decision finally make for you? Like, what, what happened there? Yeah. Absolutely. It was a real powerful moment for me. Um, what shifted... Oh, there's a whole lot I could talk about in that moment. Um, I was experiencing what all my clients, what we've just talked about now. I was... I had my inner world was coming up against this, this edge of possibility, and all the old narratives, all the things that had gone wrong, all my perceived failures, all the, the businesses, all the things were telling me, "You can't do this. This is not working. Who do you think you are?" All the things. So I was in one of those places where I knew that I didn't have the answers to all the questions I was looking for. I had been, um, very diligent in doing the work and showing up and being powerful in, in my industry and what I do, but I also was noticing that the results that I was getting in my, in my personal life, but also in my business life, weren't aligned with the dream, with what I wanted to create. And so I was having that internal battle taking place, um, very frequently, all the time pretty much, and this masterclass ended up coming across my screen. Uh, thankful, so thankful for my friend sending it to me. She goes, "I think this is right up your alley. You need to watch this." So I jumped on in, I watched, and my whole world, in internal world, if... And, and you'll see I'm very visual, right? So my internal world felt like fireworks was going off. Like, oh my gosh, it came alive, and it's like, "This is the answer." Answer to all the questions I've been asking. And with much delight, I was like, I have to discover more about what's going on here and why that has now impacted me so powerfully in just a 90-minute workshop. So there has to be so much more. So I pushed into that, discovered more, and so grateful that I took that step and said yes to myself and went, "This is where I need to be." Because these tools, this program, all the things that I'm now certified in, this is the answer to all the questions that not only I'm asking, but so many of my clients are asking. So why would I not do that? So yeah, that was... It was quite a moment. Mm. Oh, that's incredible. Yeah. Yeah. Al- all right. So what does that framework then look like inside a coaching enga- engagement with you? Hmm. So for the most part, for example, um, one of the, the program, my favorite one is the Dream Builder program that I mentioned earlier. And so just to give you a glimpse inside, what it looks like is we meet together over three months. It's, um, 12 sessions in total, um, generally in small groups, but I also do it one-on-one, um, if that's a request. Uh, we come together in our Zoom calls to explore the, the curriculum that we're learning. So we have an online portal that has some beautiful bite-sized videos that people can either watch or download the audio and listen to, and then we also have a workbook that they can work through that sh- just kind of deepens the work, helps them activate that. So asking beautiful, deep questions. So you watch the videos, you work through the workbook, and then in the, the Zoom call, in our, in our group coaching call there, that's when we unpack it all. That's when we make it real. That's when we put it into action. So we're not just doing this work as entertainment, we're doing this for transformation, so there's activation in that. So fortunately, what I love is that every single client that comes on for me, their life experience will be speaking into the very things that we're learning. So they have real time experiences happening, and we can thrash that out inside the Zoom call to actually land it within them, the learning, why that's happening, and the new measure of understanding that's being revealed. So they'll learn a whole new operating system, they learn all the tools, they learn the very system that we teach that is proven reliable and repeatable, and they come out the other side with great transformation. A lot of my clients see shifts and major changes start to unfold in the first couple of weeks, and then by the end of three months they're like, "Oh my gosh, look what just happened to my world." Um, they're a completely different person as they come out the other side, and then they can continue on in some other programs that I have available or just rinse and repeat and do it all over again. Wow. Yeah. That's amazing. Mm, mm. So you're certified through the Brave Thinking Institute, um, and trained under Mary Morrissey. Mary Morrissey, yeah. Uh, yep. So and w- that, that was the masterclass that you had taken. Yeah. Yeah, yeah. At Women's, yeah. So what is it from that that really sh- that you took, maybe, like, the top three pieces from that that you, that you take and you use in your daily practice? I think a little bit I've already reflected in some of the questions we've talked about. Definitely the practice of pausing every day to be in the practice of my dream. So to give you an example- I had, um, I have four beautiful children, and my eldest, he's 25, he's married, and he lives in California. And so long way away from us, and he and his beautiful wife, uh, fell pregnant last year. And when they shared the news with me, as you could tell, this, this chickie was, uh, extremely happy and thrilled and did all the tears and the dancing on the FaceTime, and did the mommy, the, the oma thing, 'cause I'm oma now. And so this is my first grandbaby. And so I held a dream to be able to go and visit and to hold my granddaughter and to have that experience. Now, I've only been to America once, so this was going to be my second trip over, and it was really important to me that I would be able to make the time to go over in, um, in the first couple of months after she was born. So the practice that I had was I had the dream of being, of seeing Stevie in my arms, holding her just here, actually. I would do this and do this, and then I would pat her as if she's right here in my hands, and I'd rock in my chair, which I won't rock 'cause it'll squeak right now. I rock in my chair, and I would practice this. And I did this all the time in my coaching calls with my clients, 'cause we would practice our dream, and I would do it every day. I would just practice holding her and rocking her in my arms. Now, it's, it's, it becomes a practice that you start to do that you become so familiar with it as if it's just part of your every day. And so then when it turned out that I ended up in America when Stevie was three months old and I got to visit and I'm standing in the kitchen at their, at my son's house. I hadn't seen him for a year and a half, and this is the first time I've been in his home. Here I am in a moment where I'm holding Stevie. He and his wife are getting ready to go out, and I'm rocking her backwards and forwards in the kitchen, and all of a sudden I've got tears in my eyes going, "I have lived this dream for the last nine months, and now I'm actually in the dream." Wow. So that's, that's a practice that I do all the time because I love to make it visceral, like a physical sort of experience for me where I'm practicing out that experience. So I do that with my dreams, uh, throughout the day, but at least in the morning as I'm waking up in the morning. Um, I also have a gratitude practice where I will always make sure that I am starting the day in gratitude for all the beautiful things that I have in my world right now. And gratitude is a very high frequency, so you wanna be operating in that as a constant, right? Yeah. I think you, you both know that. Yep. And, um, as a third practice that I love to do, um, I really enjoy this space of, um- Of documenting, I like to journal. Mm. So I'm a bit of a journaler. So, um, I will make sure that throughout, uh, like throughout the day if necessary, but in particular in the evenings, I wanna pause and notice my thoughts. I wanna notice any thoughts that ke- kept me back, and I wanna notice any thoughts that allow me to move forward. And so as I pay attention to those, then I know what I'm moving on, what I'm practicing on throughout the next day to strengthen and to release. Yeah. I love that. Mm. It sounds like you, you live your life and do business very deliberately. Yeah. Very much so. Or intentionally is probably a more- Intentionally buzzword these days. Yeah. So yeah. It is. Yeah. Yes. Okay, let's... Can we talk about, um, the, the business itself and, and what you're building and, and what you're focusing on right now? Where's that sort of growth edge for you at the moment? What are you working on? Ah, yeah, great question, um, because aren't we... we're always working on something. We've always got a green growing edge of becoming. Yes. Yeah. Um, for me, it is definitely that beautiful space of consistently showing up, um, being totally honest with myself in terms of my schedule and my calendar. So our calendar is our greatest gift, and when we can maximize that to our greatest potential, it will serve us really, really well. So my green growing edge is, as I've now moved to the Sunshine Coast and I'm now meeting a lot more people in person as opposed to being online, I'm holding this beautiful tentative space of what does it look like to have a very fulfilling calendar that supports me and supports my business. So practicing these onl- um, I still do a little bit of online work, but now I'm more, much more in person. So I'm conscious of my time in terms of appointments with people, um, when I'm networking, and when I'm actually doing outreach and talking to, to prospects and beautiful clients and, and serving my community. Um, so I, I'm making sure that client delivery, um, is, is really important. Admin is really important, but the greater measure for me now is outreach and consistency in that, so that I can support potential people coming into the work that I do. The Business Game is proud to partner with HighLevel, the all-in-one CRM and marketing platform built for growing businesses. With CRM funnel, website, and course builders, marketing automations, email builders, and so much more, HighLevel Software will drive your customer retention and your profits through the stratosphere. And HighLevel is fully white label, which means you can brand the platform and mobile app with your logo and company colors, and then resell it to your customers for a monthly subscription. Ready to go High Level? Click on the link below to begin your 14-day free trial. Yep. So just on that, it, do you, you, you still would have challenges in business, right? Like, not everything goes smoothly. Yeah. Um, how do you deal with those things? Or, or do you Maybe said differently, do you feel better equipped to deal with the challenges of business given where you are with your, I guess your journey? Yeah. Second, the second one. Better equipped. Um, definitely have such a different way of looking at any challenges that come my way. Um, you'll find that I'm the girl that celebrates a challenge, um, way more than I ever used to. Like, uh, I happy dance quite a lot in my house. If a challenge shows up, it's like, "Let's get excited. This is a good thing 'cause there's something coming. There's some wisdom to come. There's something to learn. There's an opportunity available to me, and I get to learn to be non-resistant to anything that wants to step in my way. So I'm gonna go around or over or under you, doesn't really matter. I'm still gonna keep moving, so what are you here to show me?" Uh, so yeah, definitely much better equipped, and I have a beautiful support team as well. As much as I coach people, I'm coached. So I have beautiful coaches in and around me to help me move through any of those barriers that might be wanting to present themselves, because in essence, they're not a barrier. I'm just gonna move through and keep going. Yeah. Yeah. Wow. I, I, I can believe you'd be doing happy- Yeah dances, right? Like- Yeah. I, I didn't find that inauthentic in any way. No. Oh, I'm glad. Thank you. I wanna circle back quickly, just, um, around the topic of the calendar, because I think that a lot of founders really struggle with time management. You know- Mm they kinda get into You, we touched on it briefly, where they're getting into this head space of like, "Nope, I've gotta keep grinding. I've gotta do all these things, um, because this is what's gonna bro- grow the bus- the business." Mm. And, uh, time is the sacrifice. Mm. How are you helping them rewrite that internal story? Mm. A- and it's, it's just in what you said there. If you're gonna make time as the sacrifice, then it will be the sacrifice. But what if time is your greatest asset and you harness that for your good? Um, it's really a viewpoint, and so you can certainly go, "I don't have enough time. I'm time poor," or you can come into this conversation and go, "I have more than enough time. I'm working with the way that the universe works, so I know it's, I'm being supported. So therefore, I can quantify and take good care of my time in such a way that I will have divine appointments, things will turn up out of the blue, all the resources will come as I need it, because I'm prioritizing the things that are of great value and importance to me in terms of growing my business." All right. You work with, with visionary leaders, um, Kerrianne, and I guess- Every business has challenges and problems, and, and because you work with people at different levels, do you find that those challenges and problems are almost the same across the board, or do they vary with different size businesses and industries? That's a brilliant question. From my experience, though, because I'm working with the individual, regardless of the size of the business, it's what the individual's carrying, because we're creating their inner capacity to do the work that they do. So regardless of what the external situation is that they're facing, my interest is in the internal world, and what we're generating in here. So we're creating a coherent match to the dream. Uh, whatever it is that's h- conflicting in the internal world, it's just that's where the focus is. So everything will outflow from that to support the business, no matter what level or measure of experience they have in. Mm. Mm. And do you find... I mean, because there's a lot of ego around entrepreneurship and leadership in business, right? Mm. That's part of the, I guess, what makes it work, because you make things happen, and do people, do clients, when they come to you at first, do they have trouble opening up? Do you get resistance? And, and if so, how do you work with that? Because sometimes being vulnerable is really hard, right? Yes. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, yeah, absolutely, and it's something to be cherished. So one of the things that is important to me is creating a safe place in any of the rooms that I'm in, and to be one who can be attentive and to listen and to hear the experience of someone, um, personally and, and genuinely. So it's one of the things that is a high value for me. And so what I do find is a lot of people who come into the room with me, because of the energy that I carry in that space, it does bring resistance down quite quickly and allows somebody to show up in their genuine, authentic self. And as with all my varied experience on me in business and in, in coaching and learning and, and, and owning the driving school, it allowed me to actually come to a place where I can really be one-on-one with a person, no matter how they learn, no matter how they experience life. It really doesn't matter, because I will meet them exactly where they're at. So if they're high vision and see images, I can meet that space. If they're more of an, they just know things, and, uh, they have trouble articulating, I can meet them there. So I adapt and move with the person that I'm sitting with so that I can meet them exactly where they're at, and that tends to create a s- a sense of safety, a sense of being seen and understood, and then allows people to open up, knowing that, uh, I'm y- I'm a safe place for them to be, uh, and to connect with. And so it's something that is a very high value for me, so I ensure that that, that is what they experience in a, in, in a session with me. Yeah, right, and you work with both men and women, right? Yes, I do. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah So which is beautiful. Yeah. And you're obviously dealing with different people at different stages of business. Do you see a similar thread of problems between all these different people or is it vary based on where they're at in business? Yeah, it does vary. Um, you know, for some people coming in, it's... A- and this is where the life coaching part of this comes in. So as much as I'm working with people in business, I'm really honoring the life in which they're living. So they might come to me because they're having a stuck point in business, but the actual issue might do- be to do with love and relationships, like they're having problems with their, their spouse, or their, they have a big heart's desire to find the love of their life. Or perhaps, like another client of mine, a deep desire to have really good, solid friendships in their world, where they can just show up and be them. And that then overflows into the business, which then creates results in the business. So when I hold space with somebody, it's to a- actually allow ourselves to identify the real core issue that's happening there, if it's more personal as opposed to just business, or if it's a blend of the two, so that we can support them to continue to move forward. And, and i- it usually surfaces in the first couple of weeks, so we're able to see what that is. Yeah. Yeah. Wow. I definitely could've used you when I was doing Lendi. This has come just a bit too late, hasn't it? Too, yeah. Yeah. Um, so burnout, let's talk about burnout, 'cause I don't think we can have a conversation around- Yeah this without- Yeah talking about burnout 'cause it's, you know, common. So it's often framed as, like, a time management or a workload problem, but y- you approach it, uh, more as an identity and capacity issue. Can you break down what you mean by that- Mm and give us, yeah, an e- an example of how it plays out with a client? Yeah, absolutely. So when we think about it, um, the, the natural narrative that's happening in the world today is that it's because we have too much to do, so we're burning out because we've, we've left ourselves turned on 24/7 many, many times in a row, 7, 14, 28 days. Um, w- what if, though, it is caused by believing that everything depends on you? So i- you know, I've ha- had many clients who have been through this space where they, it's an identity piece. It's like, "Everything happens in this world because I show up. If I don't show up, and if I don't do all the work, then everything will fall apart. So I take all the weight of the world onto my shoulders. I come into this space, and I burn myself out proving that I'm the only one that can do all the work." Yeah. Now, if you're not the one that can do all the work, if there are other people that can support you, if there are ways to bring support in for you, if there is ways to take things off your plate, if there are ways that your calendar could actually feel really good and life-giving to you, and you don't have to be the one doing all the work, running on the adrenaline, full of stress, overwhelmed, overrided, up at 2:00 AM in the morning- If you could switch all that off and have a completely different experience, your life would be amazing, but you're still so valuable. The issue is that we think our value is caught up in all that activity and all that adrenaline and all that work, but it's, uh, that's not the value piece. You are valuable regardless of all of that. And so there's definitely a space for me in the work that I do in identity first and then the outflow from there. And when you can release all that and trust that you can rest and that other people can do their jobs in and around you because you've brought in a great team, then you can actually have a very fulfilling life without having to be running on the adrenaline, the stress, the anxiety that you've known up until now that has kept you functioning and drinking all that coffee. You can step out of that and operate from rest and actually take a day off or go for an overseas holiday just 'cause you can and your business will still operate and everything will be fine. Yeah. Wow. That's got a little bit uncomfortable and close to home, Colleen. Did you know that? I was like, "Are we in my therapy session today?" Yeah. The invoice is in the mail, right? Yeah. I know. Seriously. Well, so Kerry-Ann, just on that then, what do you do to switch off or to, to have that me time so that you don't burn out? Oh, I have some very favorite things that I do. Um, this week for example, I took an afternoon off and took myself down to the beach, put my feet in the sand, enjoyed the sunshine and just had a couple hours to myself before coming back to, uh, to home and doing dinner and all the things with my daughters here at home. Um, I love a good book. I love going to the markets. I love having weekends off. Oh my goodness. I don't wanna work weekends. I work Monday through to Friday. I have weekends off and I give myself permission to do that and know that everything can wait through till Monday. So I love to, like I s- It's come back to, it's that calendar conversation today, isn't it? Coming back to the calendar and just going what's really valuable and important to me. I make sure that I have time in my schedule to meet my dear friends so I can have a coffee catch up once a week with a good friend. Um, make sure I definitely get beach time. I love walking. I love going on hikes and exercising, so there's always that a- at least once a day, if not twice. If I can fit it in twice, I'll do it twice. Um, but I'm just allowing for those things that bring me life and joy. So I go through different seasons with things. Like you'll see the paintings up in the background here. I love to paint when I have an opportunity to paint. I love to write books so mi- I might write. But I find creative endeavors and, and things that bring me joy. So- Mm th- that's a big answer. Yeah. That's all the things. Or, or I've got, I've got a little... Uh, you've kind of... I, I think I know how you're gonna respond to this, but I've got another piece to that. What about guilt? Um, because, you know, I've... successful business owner, if I take time off, X might happen or, um, I won't feel worthy of the success. Do, do you come across guilt in a lot of business leaders? And if so, why do we feel that way, and how do you deal with it? You know, guilt's a big part of it, isn't it? If you've got that, if, if you're tying your identity into and your belief system into your business as a representation of your success, uh, then you're gonna feel guilty if you ever step away from it. Yeah. Guilty for spending time with the kids. Guilty going to the beach- Yeah or doing my painting or whatever it might be. Mm. Yeah. Absolutely. Mm. But if, if, if therefore your identity is not tied into your business, and your business and its supposed success of what that might look like to you, if your identity is not connected to that, then it changes the conversation. Your business is an expression of the beauty of what you carry within you, the, the brilliance that you're showing up with. So it's not actually that it comes out and forms all the future and everything that's gonna work in your life. It's not the, the identity piece. You're the identity piece. Wow. The business is just an expression of that. Your family is an expression of that. The, the home that you live in is an expression of that. How clean your car is every day is an expression of that. Like, your identity is in you. These are just expressions of how your identity shows up. Right. So you can disengage from that and therefore not feel guilty. Go home and clean the car, I think. Are you gonna do that as well? We've got little kids. That does not work. Does not happen for a while. All right. So I guess on, on a similar theme to that then, I mean, you're a life mastery consultant, an international speaker, an author, a trainer, your own coaching practice and so forth. Wow, that's a lot. So how do you personally apply the inner coherence principles so, so that, you know, you thrive and enjoy wearing all of those hats without losing yourself? Mm. Yeah. And I guess it just depends on, and like we've talked about already, okay, depends on your point of view, right? Yeah. So you could look at that and go, "Oh my gosh, she has a heck of a lot of hats on." Yeah. I'm not wearing them all at the one time, and I'm not trying on different hats to see what else feels good. I'm an author because there was a season in my time where I wanted to write a book, and I spent intentionality and focus and creative energy on the writing the book process, and I published a book. So that makes me an author. So I'm an international speaker when I have an opportunity to go internationally and speak, when, like last year in November, I went to Dubai and spoke at a founders and leaders women's in business experience, and had a blast with that. But do you know what I did? I also took my daughter with me. She was my assistant. So we had mother-daughter time away. We turned it into a holiday. We went to London as well. So I c- made an experience out of that for not just me, but also for my daughter. And so whenever I am considering this kind of question, it's like, well, I'm doing this in the flow and the substance of life that feels good to me. So when I'm coaching, I have two or three days in the week that are allotted for when I have coaching calls, and that's, that's when they happen. And the other days of the week, I have other things allotted into those particular times because that's what feels good to me. So we create a life and a calendar in and around the things that feel life-giving and supportive. I'm keen to write another book, but I've put that into a three-year vision. It's out a little bit because there are a couple other things that I need to have come together for my business first before I'm willing to invest that kind of time into writing my book. When that's, when that's aligned, it's gonna come into my realm of reference. It's going to be like, "Whoop, whoop. It's time to write the book." I'm gonna feel it. I'm gonna know it. I'm gonna feel energy on it, and everything will line up for that. Right now, my energy is in the space of networking, connecting with clients, and speaking, so I'm developing that side of my business at the moment. So we move with the ebbs and flows, just like the ocean coming in and the ocean going out. And when you're really in tune with the vision that you carry, the dream that you have for your business, and the energetics of that, you'll know what to say yes to and what to say no to, and when it's important to keep moving in the direction of the yes. Mm. Yeah. Wow. Mm. So for a business owner listening right now who's really resonating with everything that you've described, the overwhelm, the burnout, the gap between the vision and the reality, um, that sense of something that internal needs, needs to shift, what's one thing that you would invite them to look at first before doing anything else? Mm. Ah. The one thing that I absolutely love bringing people into is obviously calming your mind for a minute so that you can answer this one question. It's really allowing your heart to have an expression, and I'm gonna say it that way 'cause that's how I love to communicate it, with this question: what would I love? Anybody that's in business should be asking that question just about every day. What would I love? What would I love my life to look like? What would I love my business to look like? What would I love my relationships to look like? What would I love? Because when we get really familiar and comfortable with that question, our heart then actually communicates the very things that we would love, and we get to know it, and we get to dream into that, and we get to believe for something that's greater than what we've created up until now. So m- the first thing would be, let's pause for a minute and really allow yourself to consider if nothing held you back and you didn't have any constriction, not time, not money, not talent, not education, not where you live, not the econ- nothing held you back, and you can have any experience in your life, what would you love that to be? What would that look like? Mm. Mm. So that would be the one thing. Well, yeah. That- Powerful yeah, that reminds me of Justin Brown when he was here. He was talking about follow the fun and the excitement. Yes. Yeah. And your expression to follow the love, right? Like- Yes that's a really interesting, um- It's alignment, right? Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. So th- there's clearly something in that, in creating successful, powerful businesses. So true. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. All right. Have you got any more questions, Kaleena, or are we going to quick-fire? Uh, one question, I think, just to, like, get a, a better understanding for, maybe for our listeners and even for myself. When you say an ex- ex- it's an expression of rather than a w- uh, 'cause you ex- you explained certain things as an expression, not an identity. What's the separation there? What's the difference? Mm. Like, how do you separate yourself- Mm from an expression? Mm. 'Cause it's still an... To me, when I heard that, I'm like, "Yeah, I get it," but how I express myself is how I identify. Mm. So, you know, and when you said the thing about the car, I have this huge thing about my car being messy, and I hate it, but I've got little kids- and it's reality. But I hate it. Like, it makes me feel like someone who's disorganized, and I'm not. Internally, I'm, like, so organized. But it's like... So when you said that, I, like, I f- I actually felt my inside kinda go like, "Oh, well, that means that I'm-" I'm not. You know what I mean? Where are you sending the invoice? That's the- Yeah, yeah, no. Yeah, yeah. I think other people might have the same question- Oh, okay. You're having a sale around this idea. Oh, I'm having a sale. Yeah, yeah. Yeah. That's beautiful. Yeah. I love it. I love that you noticed that you had a, a tightening, a little, like, check in your system going, "Oh, oh, that, that, that's a little bit tender." Yeah. And so, yeah, we pay attention to that. So- Yeah it's a beautiful question. I love what you're asking. And yes, there are seasons where, you know, you've got little kids. Life looks different. But we hold such... We live in an environment where we hold such high standards for how life should look, how clean things should be, how organized everything should be. So who's to say that for a mom with little kids who is doing abundantly well in her life with her family, with her business, and all the creative endeavors that you have, that your car expression right now looks a little bit different to what you would love it to be. It, it's okay. But in that, in that it is, it is ultimately an expression of the life, the fullness of life that you have right now. You have beautiful children. Yeah, right. And they love leaving things in the car, and that's just, that's, that's how rich your life is right now. Yeah. Your identity piece in that is that you are a very successful mom who knows how to bring up amazing kids who are free to be able to drop things on the floor in the car. Very free. Have that kind of expression in their life. But it's still... You know, they have that expression in life, but that's still not their identity. Yeah, right. Their identity is their, your, your son, your daughter, your amazing little person that is an expression of you that's here on the planet right now, and you get to be their mom, and you're brilliant at it, and this is what it looks like right now. Okay. Does that kind of help that land a bit? Yeah. Yeah, I think so. Does that make... Do you feel- Yeah do you feel like you have an understanding now of the... Yeah. Yeah, absolutely, 'cause it, it, I think it gets back to that intentionality piece- Yeah you know, of- Yeah um, taking that time to s- what, where is it, where am I and where is this thing in life right now, right? Yeah. And, and being, being intentional and, and honest about that I think is what, is what I'm getting from that. Yes. Yeah. Yeah. And there's seasons for everything. Yeah. Like what we talked about with Kat earlier, you know. Yeah. Yeah. Okay. Yeah. Cool. Well, thank you for that. You're welcome. All good. All right. Well, I'm sure... Look, it's a good question, Ryan. I'm sure li- uh, people, a number of people listening will go, "Actually, yeah, that's... I had that question, too." So- Y- yeah yeah. Well, just to differentiate- Yeah and get an understanding. Absolutely. Yeah. Yeah. Okay. Mm. I think we're gonna jump into the quick-fire questions. Okay. All righty. Um, to get to know the person behind the microphone a little bit more, Kerry-Ann, what we do is we ask you 10 questions. We'll alternate our questions, and we ask you to answer them in a sentence or less. Ooh. So are you ready to go? Ready to go. Right. I'm a little nervous, but I'm ready. You ready? Okay. You ready to go? I'm ready. All right. You wanna go first- Yep or want me to? Okay, I'll take the lead. Okay, yeah. All right. Would you prefer to build a business or buy a business? Build a business. Okay. Revenue or profit? Revenue. Growth or stability? Mm. I'm gonna say growth. I wanna answer both, but growth. That's an, uh, an answer we get often, right? Yeah. That's where people go, "Oh." Yeah. "Come on, oh." Yeah. "Don't make me pick." Yeah. Hire fast or hire slow? Oh, that's another one that I wanna say both to. Um, I'm gonna say hire fast. Take the money or keep control? Mm. Take the money. Mm-hmm. I like it. Bootstrapped or venture backed? Venture backed. Mm. Big idea or great execution? Oh, big idea. Mm. Perfect product or first to market? Perfect product. What's one piece of advice you wish someone would've given you at 25? Dream bigger. Mm. Ooh, I like that. Mm-hmm. And what's one business mistake you'd happily make again? Um, saying yes to myself. Mm. Nice. Mm-hmm. All right, one final question. If business truly is a game, Kerry-Ann, what is your definition of winning? It's having a very good time on the way to the end. Mm. Mm, I like that. Nice. Yeah. That's such a nice- Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Wow. Okay, so where can, um, our listeners find you and your business online? Oh, well, uh, all our beautiful socials, so you can find me on Facebook, Instagram, or LinkedIn. Um, but the best place is jumping onto my website, which is kinda like the shortened version of my name. So I didn't even get to mention this earlier, but I am Kerry-Ann, but most people know me as KA. So you can find me at www.kaluketic.com. Perfect. Okay. Awesome. That's great. Yeah. Well, thank you. Thank you, KA. Yeah, thank you, KA. And, and congratulations on being a grandma, too. Yeah. Thank you. Yeah. Thank you, thank you. Well, thanks so much for joining us on the show. Yes. This has been a great conversation. Yeah. I know, um, I've personally pulled a We'll send the invoice. It's all right. Yes. Yeah, yeah. Yeah, yeah. So thank you so much. All right, well, that's all we've got time for. If you've enjoyed this episode, make sure to subscribe to The Business Game, and check out the playlist for the level of business you're currently playing. Because every founder is somewhere on the game board, from zero all the way to over $50 billion. Choose your level, and we'll see you next time